Crystal Report Viewer

1000 ‎Rochester Hills Dr‎

Rochester Hills‎, ‎MI ‎

48309‎

(‎248‎) ‎656‎-‎4600‎

Home Page‎: ‎

www‎.‎rochesterhills‎.‎org‎

Rochester Hills

Minutes

Planning Commission

Chairperson William Boswell‎, ‎Vice Chairperson Deborah Brnabic‎

Members‎: ‎Gerard Dettloff‎, ‎Dale Hetrick‎, ‎Greg Hooper‎, ‎Nicholas O‎. ‎Kaltsounis‎,‎

David A‎. ‎Reece‎, ‎C‎. ‎Neall Schroeder‎, ‎Emmet Yukon‎

7:00 PM

1000 Rochester Hills Drive

Tuesday, June 18, 2013

CALL TO ORDER

Chairperson William Boswell called the Regular Meeting to order at ‎7‎:‎00 ‎

p‎.‎m‎. ‎in the Auditorium‎.‎

ROLL CALL

William Boswell‎, ‎Deborah Brnabic‎, ‎Gerard Dettloff‎, ‎Dale Hetrick‎, ‎Greg ‎

Hooper‎, ‎Nicholas Kaltsounis‎, ‎David Reece‎, ‎C‎. ‎Neall Schroeder and Emmet ‎

Yukon‎

Present

9 -

Quorum Present‎.‎

Also present‎: ‎Ed Anzek‎, ‎Director of Planning and Economic Dev‎.‎

James Breuckman‎, ‎Manager of Planning‎

Maureen Gentry‎, ‎Recording Secretary‎

APPROVAL OF MINUTES

2013-0212

May ‎21‎, ‎2013 ‎Regular Meeting‎

A motion was made by Schroeder‎, ‎seconded by Hetrick‎, ‎that this matter be ‎

Approved as Presented‎. ‎The motion carried by the following vote‎:‎

Aye

Boswell‎, ‎Brnabic‎, ‎Dettloff‎, ‎Hetrick‎, ‎Hooper‎, ‎Kaltsounis‎, ‎Reece‎, ‎Schroeder ‎

and Yukon‎

9 -

COMMUNICATIONS

A‎)‎ 2014-2019‎ Capital Improvement Plan‎

B‎)‎ Trailways Fall Classic Ride ‎& ‎Walk Invitation for Sept‎. ‎28‎, ‎2013‎

UNFINISHED BUSINESS

2013-0189

Request for Conditional Land Use Recommendation ‎- ‎City File No‎. ‎13‎-‎005 ‎- ‎to ‎

construct a used car lot on ‎.‎28 ‎acres at ‎1927 ‎E‎. ‎Auburn‎, ‎between John R and ‎

Dequindre‎, ‎zoned C‎-‎I‎, ‎Commercial Improvement‎, ‎Parcel No‎. ‎15‎-‎25‎-‎482‎-‎021‎, ‎

Syed Ahmed‎, ‎Applicant‎

(‎Reference‎: ‎Staff Report prepared by James Breuckman‎, ‎dated June ‎13‎, ‎

2013‎, ‎and Site Plan prepared by Chester Stempien Associates had been ‎

placed on file and by reference became part of the record thereof‎.)‎

Present for the applicant were Syed Ahmed‎, ‎890 ‎E‎. ‎Hamlin‎, ‎Rochester ‎

Hills‎, ‎MI ‎48307 ‎and Siraj Ahmad‎, ‎Engineering Consultant‎, ‎no address of ‎

record‎.‎

Mr‎. ‎Breuckman advised that he had updated the Staff Report to highlight ‎

the items of discussion from last month’s Planning Commission meeting ‎

and to show how the applicant had addressed those‎. ‎He said that he ‎

would be happy to clarify anything or answer any questions‎.‎

Chairperson Boswell said that regarding the Site Plan Approval motion‎, ‎

condition number four said in part‎, ‎“Revision of the plans to indicate the ‎

species and size of the proposed landscaping‎.‎” He noted that they had ‎

shown that arbor vitae were listed in the details‎, ‎but he had looked up the ‎

particular tree listed ‎(‎Thuja Flicata‎) ‎on the internet‎, ‎and it showed that ‎

they grew to ‎230 ‎feet with the green at the top‎. ‎He did not feel that those ‎

would provide much of a screen wall‎. ‎He added that after about ten years‎, ‎

all the green would be very high up‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Breuckman said that could ‎

certainly be adjusted‎. ‎Chairperson Boswell asked Mr‎. ‎Ahmed if there was ‎

anything he wanted to add‎.‎

Mr‎. ‎Ahmed stated that he was the owner of the property at ‎1927 ‎E‎. ‎Auburn ‎

Rd‎. ‎He bought the property on March ‎25‎, ‎2013‎. ‎He remarked that since ‎

then‎, ‎he had not slept very well‎. ‎He had invested money‎, ‎and he wanted ‎

to start his own business‎. ‎He had been trying for a very long time to ‎

become a business owner‎, ‎and he finally got the opportunity to buy some ‎

property to start one‎. ‎He advised that the building would not stay for very ‎

long‎. ‎The previous owner rented it for a barber shop and a buy‎-‎and‎-‎sell ‎

coin shop and collected rent‎, ‎but he did not do any improvements to the ‎

building‎. ‎In Mr‎. ‎Ahmed’s case‎, ‎he said that he would build another ‎

building as soon as possible and make it a beautiful building right next to ‎

the gas station‎. ‎Looking four years back at that gas station‎, ‎it was an old ‎

building that was closed‎, ‎and it did not look good at all‎. ‎When they ‎

opened the new gas station‎, ‎a lot of activity picked up‎. ‎From John R to ‎

Dequindre on Auburn‎, ‎there was only one business that was closed‎, ‎and it ‎

was Mr‎. ‎Ahmed’s‎. ‎He wanted to put in a new building that would look very ‎

nice for the City‎. ‎He reiterated that he would do it as soon as possible‎. ‎

He commented that it was hard for him to try to convince nine people‎, ‎but ‎

whatever the City required‎, ‎he would do it‎. ‎He was going to add a nice ‎

fence ‎- ‎not an inexpensive chain link‎, ‎but a black wrought iron fence‎. ‎He ‎

could install the fence immediately and later he could use the same ‎

fence for the new building‎. ‎He asked that he be allowed to start the ‎

business‎, ‎and after he became a little established‎, ‎he could get a bank ‎

loan and construct a new building‎. ‎He stated that the building had been ‎

there for ‎30 ‎years‎. ‎Since he bought the property‎, ‎it was his intention to ‎

knock down the building and put a nice building in the back‎.‎

Mr‎. ‎Hooper stated that as far as Mr‎. ‎Ahmed’s future plans‎, ‎that was great‎, ‎

but the Commissioners were just dealing with the plan in front of them‎. ‎

When Mr‎. ‎Ahmed decided to do a future plan‎, ‎he would have to apply with ‎

the Planning Department and come back before the Commission‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎

Hooper said that he appreciated Mr‎. ‎Ahmed’s forthrightness about the ‎

fact that he wanted to help improve the City‎, ‎and he supported that‎.‎

Mr‎. ‎Ahmed stated again that the building had been rented out for ‎30 ‎

years‎. ‎He would not rent it but be his own boss‎. ‎He wanted to have a nice ‎

building‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Hooper said that he understood‎, ‎but they were talking about ‎

the existing building and the subject Site Plan‎.‎

Mr‎. ‎Hooper said that as far as the tree plantings‎, ‎they could go with ‎

pyramidal arbor vitae‎, ‎as approved by Staff‎. ‎There were many species ‎

they could determine to use‎. ‎Beyond that‎, ‎Mr‎. ‎Hooper said that he did ‎

not have any issues‎, ‎and he was willing to give Mr‎. ‎Ahmed the chance ‎

with the current plan‎. ‎

Mr‎. ‎Schroeder stated that his concern was that they had discussed having ‎

15‎-‎25 ‎cars on the lot‎, ‎and he saw five parking spots ‎- ‎not displays for cars ‎

- ‎where people would open the doors to look inside‎. ‎He asked Mr‎. ‎Ahmed ‎

what his intentions were‎.‎

Mr‎. ‎Ahmed responded that after the Commissioners said that he could ‎

not park on the lawn‎, ‎he maintained that he would not do that‎. ‎He would ‎

start with five to six cars‎, ‎and when he put up the new building‎, ‎he would ‎

have room to enlarge the parking area‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Schroeder asked Mr‎. ‎Ahmed ‎

if he could conduct a viable business with only five cars‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Ahmed ‎

agreed that he could‎, ‎and said that his business was mostly through the ‎

internet‎. ‎He bought the cars at auctions in other states ‎- ‎Wisconsin‎, ‎Ohio‎, ‎

New Jersey‎, ‎Pennsylvania‎, ‎for example‎. ‎He mostly bought from Honda ‎

and Lexus entities‎. ‎He could buy a car from the auction and park it there ‎

for a year‎. ‎When he needed a car‎, ‎his partner would bring it to his lot and ‎

park it‎, ‎but mostly his business was done through the internet‎. ‎He did not ‎

bring many cars to his place‎, ‎and four to five cars was enough to build his ‎

business‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Schroeder asked where he would park the cars‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎

Ahmed pointed out the five parking spots‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Ahmad added that ‎

customer parking would be next to the building‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Schroder said that he ‎

could not understand how Mr‎. ‎Ahmed could run a viable business with ‎

only five cars and tight parking‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Ahmed said that for now‎, ‎the cars ‎

would be parked tightly‎, ‎but in the future‎, ‎he could add more parking‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎

Schroeder said that he was afraid they would end up seeing more than ‎

five cars‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Ahmed assured that would not happen‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Schroeder said ‎

that he would like to see that guarantee in writing ‎- ‎as a condition of ‎

approval‎. ‎

Mr‎. ‎Schroeder asked Mr‎. ‎Ahmed if he had gone to MDOT for a driveway ‎

approach permit‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Ahmad said that he did‎, ‎and MDOT told him that ‎

once the plan was approved‎, ‎a permit would be required‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Schroeder ‎

asked if the location shown on the plan was approved‎, ‎which was ‎

confirmed by Mr‎. ‎Ahmad‎.‎

Mr‎. ‎Hetrick concurred with adding a condition about the number of cars ‎

allowed on the subject Site Plan‎, ‎and he stated that there should be no ‎

more than five cars for sale on the lot‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Ahmed agreed to that ‎

condition‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Hetrick observed that the future could change with another ‎

Site Plan‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Hetrick confirmed that there was a security camera on the ‎

building‎.‎

Mr‎. ‎Kaltsounis asked if this matter required a Public Hearing‎, ‎and ‎

Chairperson Boswell advised that the Public Hearing was held at the last ‎

meeting‎, ‎and it did not require another one‎. ‎Hearing no further ‎

comments‎, ‎Mr‎. ‎Kaltsounis moved the following motion adding one ‎

condition allowing no more than five cars to be parked for sale on the lot‎. ‎

MOTION‎ by Kaltsounis‎, ‎seconded by Reece‎, ‎in the matter of City File ‎

No‎. ‎13‎-‎005 ‎(‎Syed used car lot on Auburn‎) ‎the Planning Commission ‎

recommends ‎to City Council‎ approval‎ of the ‎conditional land use‎, ‎

based on plans dated received by the Planning Department on June ‎7‎, ‎

2013‎, ‎with the following five ‎(‎5‎) ‎findings and subject to the following one ‎

(‎1‎) ‎condition‎:‎

Findings‎

1‎.‎ The proposed use of the existing site and building do promote the ‎

intent and purpose of the Zoning Ordinance‎.‎

2‎.‎ The proposed building is proposed to be operated‎, ‎maintained‎, ‎and ‎

managed so as to be compatible‎, ‎harmonious‎, ‎and appropriate in ‎

appearance with the existing and planned character of the ‎

neighborhood the general vicinity‎, ‎adjacent uses of land‎, ‎the ‎

natural environment‎, ‎and the capacity of public services and ‎

facilities affected by the land use‎.‎

3‎.‎ The proposed development is served adequately by essential public ‎

facilities and services‎, ‎such as highways‎, ‎streets‎, ‎police and fire ‎

protection‎, ‎drainage ways‎, ‎and refuse disposal‎.‎

4‎.‎ The proposed development would not be detrimental‎, ‎hazardous‎, ‎or ‎

disturbing to existing or future neighboring land uses‎, ‎persons‎, ‎

property‎, ‎or the public welfare‎.‎

5‎.‎ The proposal will not‎ ‎create additional requirements at public cost for ‎

public facilities and services that will be detrimental to the ‎

economic welfare of the community‎.‎

Condition‎:‎

1‎.‎ No more than five cars shall be parked for sale on the lot‎.‎

Chairperson Boswell thought that the condition could be in the Site Plan ‎

Motion‎.‎

Ms‎. ‎Brnabic maintained that there would be no used car business if the ‎

Commission did not vote to recommend a Conditional Land Use‎. ‎She ‎

questioned why they could not add conditions to the CLU‎. ‎She was ‎

looking at it from the perspective that if an applicant did not follow the Site ‎

Plan conditions regarding having only five cars or not parking on the ‎

grass‎, ‎the applicant would be defaulting on the Conditional Land Use‎. ‎

She was not looking at it as an enforcement issue‎, ‎but rather that the CLU ‎

would be in default‎. ‎She would also like to see a condition prohibiting all ‎

displays on the grass area ‎- ‎no parking‎, ‎signs or displays of any kind‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎

Ahmed stated that he would never default‎.‎

Ms‎. ‎Brnabic asked how long Mr‎. ‎Ahmed felt it would take to install the ‎

fence and plant the landscaping‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Ahmed said that it would be as ‎

soon as possible‎. ‎If he got the approval‎, ‎he would first put in the fence‎, ‎

because it was a safety issue for him‎, ‎too‎. ‎Ms‎. ‎Brnabic asked Mr‎. ‎Ahmed ‎

if he felt it would be reasonable to put a timeframe of ‎90 ‎days for ‎

completion‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Ahmed said that he would install everything before the ‎

winter‎, ‎and that he would agree to ‎90 ‎days‎.‎

Mr‎. ‎Anzek thought that it was fine to put conditions on both the ‎

Conditional Land Use and the Site Plan‎. ‎Regarding the plantings‎, ‎he ‎

would ask that it be made date certain‎, ‎suggesting November ‎15‎, ‎2013‎, ‎

because it would be into the proper planting season‎. ‎If they said ninety ‎

days‎, ‎they would not be sure from when‎. ‎Ms‎. ‎Brnabic agreed that would ‎

be fine‎.‎

Chairperson Boswell brought up that there could be no usage of the grass ‎

area at all‎. ‎He wondered why they could not have a picnic table or ‎

something like that‎. ‎He asked if Ms‎. ‎Brnabic meant just business uses ‎

not being allowed‎. ‎Ms‎. ‎Brnabic agreed a picnic table would be much ‎

different than a displayed car‎. ‎Chairperson Boswell suggested no usage ‎

of the grassy area for parking of cars or displaying signs‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Breuckman ‎

suggested that they could say no displays of cars or advertising ‎

purposes‎.‎

Mr‎. ‎Kaltsounis asked if there were three extra conditions they should add ‎

to the CLU motion‎. ‎Chairperson Boswell asked Ms‎. ‎Brnabic if she would ‎

like those amendments added to the motion‎, ‎and she agreed‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎

Kaltsounis said that he would be willing to accept the extra conditions‎. ‎He ‎

shared a concern of Ms‎. ‎Brnabic’s about the grass‎. ‎He noted that at the ‎

last meeting‎, ‎the applicant for the former Meadowbrook Dodge site was ‎

present‎. ‎There were several areas in the parking lot that had to be ‎

remediated and cleaned up because cars leaked oil through cracks in the ‎

concrete‎. ‎He was very concerned about trying to preserve the grass on ‎

Mr‎. ‎Ahmed’s lot‎. ‎He explained that it was why they took time discussing ‎

the extra conditions‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Kaltsounis moved the finalized motion with the ‎

extra conditions‎:‎

MOTION‎ by Kaltsounis‎, ‎seconded by Reece‎, ‎in the matter of City File ‎

No‎. ‎13‎-‎005 ‎(‎Syed used car lot on Auburn‎) ‎the Planning Commission ‎

recommends ‎to City Council‎ approval‎ of the ‎conditional land use‎, ‎

based on plans dated received by the Planning Department on June ‎7‎, ‎

2013‎, ‎with the following five ‎(‎5‎) ‎findings and subject to the following three ‎

(‎3‎) ‎conditions‎:‎

Findings‎

1‎. ‎The proposed uses of the existing site and building do promote the ‎

intent and ‎

purpose of the Zoning Ordinance‎.‎

2‎.‎ The proposed building is proposed to be operated‎, ‎maintained‎, ‎and ‎

managed so as to be compatible‎, ‎harmonious‎, ‎and appropriate in ‎

appearance with the existing and planned character of the ‎

neighborhood the general vicinity‎, ‎adjacent uses of land‎, ‎the ‎

natural environment‎, ‎and the capacity of public services and ‎

facilities affected by the land use‎.‎

3‎.‎ The proposed development is served adequately by essential public ‎

facilities and services‎, ‎such as highways‎, ‎streets‎, ‎police and fire ‎

protection‎, ‎drainage ways‎, ‎and refuse disposal‎.‎

4‎.‎ The proposed development would not be detrimental‎, ‎hazardous‎, ‎or ‎

disturbing to existing or future neighboring land uses‎, ‎persons‎, ‎

property‎, ‎or the public welfare‎.‎

5‎.‎ The proposal will not‎ ‎create additional requirements at public cost for ‎

public facilities and services that will be detrimental to the ‎

economic welfare of the community‎.‎

Conditions‎:‎

1‎.‎ No more than five cars for sale shall be parked or stored on the lot‎.‎

2‎.‎ The fencing and plantings shall be installed by November ‎15‎, ‎2013‎.‎

3‎.‎ The grass area cannot be used for parking‎, ‎display or advertising ‎

purposes‎

A motion was made by Kaltsounis‎, ‎seconded by Reece‎, ‎that this matter be ‎

Recommended for Approval to the City Council Regular Meeting‎,‎. ‎The motion ‎

carried by the following vote‎:‎

Aye

Boswell‎, ‎Brnabic‎, ‎Dettloff‎, ‎Hetrick‎, ‎Hooper‎, ‎Kaltsounis‎, ‎Reece‎, ‎Schroeder ‎

and Yukon‎

9 -

Chairperson Boswell stated for the record that the motion had passed ‎

unanimously‎.‎

2013-0190

Request for Site Plan Approval ‎- ‎City File No‎. ‎13‎-‎005 ‎- ‎Used car lot at ‎1927 ‎E‎. ‎

Auburn Rd‎.‎, ‎Syed Ahmed‎, ‎Applicant‎

MOTION‎ by Kaltsounis‎, ‎seconded by Dettloff‎, ‎in the matter of City File ‎

No‎. ‎13‎-‎005 ‎(‎Syed used car lot on Auburn Rd‎.)‎, ‎the Planning Commission ‎

approves ‎the ‎site plan‎, ‎based on plans dated received by the Planning ‎

Department on June ‎7‎, ‎2013 ‎with the following one ‎(‎1‎) ‎finding and subject ‎

to the following eight ‎(‎8‎) ‎conditions‎.‎

Finding‎:‎

1‎.‎ The submitted site plan proposes to use the site as‎-‎is‎, ‎and a site plan ‎

is required only because the site also requires conditional land ‎

use approval‎. ‎For that reason‎, ‎the site need not be brought up to ‎

all current standards until development activity that requires site ‎

plan approval is proposed‎.‎

Conditions‎:‎

1‎. ‎City Council approval of the conditional land use‎.‎

2‎.‎ Executing a pathway easement and filing the executed easement with ‎

the County Register of Deeds prior to issuance of a Certificate of ‎

Occupancy for the building or the commencement of sales activity ‎

on the site‎.‎

3‎.‎ Submittal of cut sheets for exterior light fixtures‎, ‎not to exceed ‎250‎ ‎

watts‎.‎

4‎.‎ Revision of the plans to indicate the species and size of proposed ‎

landscaping‎, ‎as determined by Staff and if necessary‎, ‎revision to ‎

the number of plants proposed to ensure a complete opaque ‎

screen‎.‎

5‎.‎ Address all applicable comments from other City departments and ‎

outside agency review letters‎.‎

6‎.‎ No more than five cars for sale shall be parked or stored on the lot‎.‎

7‎.‎ The fencing and plantings shall be installed by November ‎15‎, ‎2013‎.‎

8‎.‎ The grass area cannot be used for parking‎, ‎display or advertising ‎

purposes‎

Chairperson Boswell recommended that the tree species be changed‎. ‎If ‎

they stayed with what was proposed‎, ‎there would be ‎12 ‎logs going out in ‎

the air with a little green at the top‎. ‎He commented that it was called giant ‎

arbor vitae for a reason‎. ‎He suggested changing it to winter arbor vitae or ‎

conical arbor vitae‎, ‎to be approved by Staff‎. ‎He was not sure that ‎12 ‎

would even be the optimum number‎.‎

Mr‎. ‎Anzek said that he just went through this exercise with the Vistas of ‎

Rochester Hills‎. ‎The residents were concerned about their view into the ‎

detention area‎, ‎so he worked with Gerry Lee of the Forestry division‎, ‎who ‎

identified a certain arbor vitae species that grew to a ‎15 ‎to ‎20‎-‎foot height ‎

with a spread of eight feet‎. ‎If they were planted eight feet on center‎, ‎it ‎

would make a perfect screen wall‎. ‎He asked that the Commission ‎

entrusted Staff to take care of it‎. ‎

Chairperson Boswell revised condition number four as listed above‎. ‎

Mr‎. ‎Reece asked Mr‎. ‎Ahmed if the grass area had a sprinkler system‎. ‎

Mr‎. ‎Ahmed replied that it did not‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Reece suggested that Mr‎. ‎Ahmed ‎

would have to get a pretty long hose to keep the new plants watered and ‎

alive‎, ‎because it would be his responsibility‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Ahmed said that he ‎

would do that‎.‎

A motion was made by Kaltsounis‎, ‎seconded by Dettloff‎, ‎that this matter be ‎

Approved‎. ‎The motion carried by the following vote‎:‎

Aye

Boswell‎, ‎Brnabic‎, ‎Dettloff‎, ‎Hetrick‎, ‎Hooper‎, ‎Kaltsounis‎, ‎Reece‎, ‎Schroeder ‎

and Yukon‎

9 -

Chairperson Boswell thanked Mr‎. ‎Ahmed for his patience‎, ‎for doing what ‎

the Commissioners had asked and for putting his business in Rochester ‎

Hills‎.‎

DISCUSSION

2013-0111

Riverbend Park Project ‎- ‎HRC‎, ‎Presenters‎

(‎Reference‎: ‎Memo prepared by James Breuckman‎, ‎dated June ‎13‎, ‎2013 ‎

and Riverbend Park Master Plan and associated documents‎, ‎prepared ‎

by HRC had been placed on file and by reference became part of the ‎

record thereof‎.)‎

Present for the discussion was James Burton‎, ‎Hubbell‎, ‎Roth ‎& ‎Clark‎, ‎Inc‎, ‎

555 ‎Hulet Drive‎, ‎P‎.‎O‎. ‎Box ‎824‎, ‎Bloomfield Hills‎, ‎MI ‎48303‎-‎0824‎. ‎

Mr‎. ‎Burton explained that he was before the Commissioners to give an ‎

update‎, ‎share some of the great ideas put forth and answer any ‎

questions‎. ‎He indicated that the Riverbend Park project was very diverse‎, ‎

and that they had a very diverse team working on it‎. ‎His firm had joined ‎

with a landscape architect firm‎, ‎Landscape‎, ‎Architects and Planners that ‎

did a lot of park projects‎, ‎and they had done all the graphics in the ‎

presentation‎. ‎The third member of the team was Niswander ‎

Environmental‎. ‎They had done a lot of work in Rochester Hills as wetland ‎

specialists and ecologists‎. ‎

Mr‎. ‎Burton noted that the site was surrounded by several subdivisions‎: ‎

Pheasant Ring‎, ‎Clinton River Valley‎, ‎Heritage Oaks and Christian Hills‎. ‎

There was an area next to the southeast corner of the park that belonged ‎

to Heritage Oaks‎, ‎and the team had started talking to them about a ‎

possible future addition to the park to accommodate invasive species ‎

control and add a water feature‎.‎

Mr‎. ‎Burton mentioned the Parks and Recreation Master Plan‎, ‎and said ‎

that out of all the comments from a survey about what residents wanted to ‎

see‎, ‎the top three were preserving open space‎, ‎having biking and walking ‎

trails and nature areas and protecting historically sensitive areas‎. ‎He ‎

stated that the park project would accomplish all three of those in a very ‎

environmentally sensitive manner‎.‎

Mr‎. ‎Burton pointed out that there were areas in the community for ball ‎

fields‎, ‎dog parks and concerts‎, ‎but said the park project was not that ‎

opportunity‎. ‎The City had owned the property for a long time‎, ‎but was ‎

really starting to understand the value of the property‎. ‎The Clinton River ‎

ran through the middle of it‎, ‎which was a very valuable economic ‎

development‎. ‎They also found numerous varieties of habitats‎, ‎including ‎

one that was very rare in this part of Michigan‎. ‎It was something to be ‎

protected‎, ‎celebrated and enhanced‎. ‎The three key elements of the ‎

project were environmental stewardship‎, ‎preservation and vibrant ‎

habitats‎, ‎and they wanted to raise awareness and education opportunities ‎

that existed‎. ‎He felt that it was really important to promote healthy living ‎- ‎

to keep people moving and to spend time in a clean‎, ‎healthy ‎

environment‎.‎

Mr‎. ‎Anzek added that the City had owned the property for at least ‎20 ‎

years‎. ‎He recalled when the students from Lawrence Technological ‎

University ‎(‎LTU‎) ‎presented a concept for the park to the Planning ‎

Commission‎. ‎Professor Ralph Nunez from the University came to the ‎

City and asked if there were any sites that they could look at to do a ‎

student project‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Nunez was present‎, ‎and Mr‎. ‎Anzek said that he was ‎

the person who started the work on the concept and got the ball rolling‎.‎

Mr‎. ‎Burton stated that the Mayor and Staff challenged his firm to make ‎

the park different and to make it a destination that was very special‎. ‎A lot ‎

of the ideas that were still white‎-‎boarded came from the LTU students‎. ‎

They gave a top‎-‎notch presentation‎, ‎and it made HRC raise its game‎. ‎

Through a relationship with Mayor Barnett‎, ‎a local gentleman‎, ‎Steve ‎

Stolaruk‎, ‎who was looking for opportunities to donate to the community‎, ‎

committed to a large donation of time and resources into re‎-‎development ‎

of the park‎. ‎

Mr‎. ‎Burton continued that the team had already completed initial site ‎

evaluations and eco‎-‎system evaluations and had come up with several ‎

concepts‎. ‎They had met with the MDEQ‎, ‎which was absolutely necessary ‎

to have onboard‎. ‎MDEQ was very excited about the opportunity‎. ‎It would ‎

be preservation of thousands of feet of river in a developed community‎. ‎

They had also started to engage the public‎. ‎They met with the four ‎

subdivisions‎, ‎and it was very well attended‎. ‎There were more comments ‎

about people wanting to get started than questions about lighting or ‎

fencing‎. ‎He stated that there was a very positive response‎. ‎

Mr‎. ‎Burton pointed out the Clinton River running through the park‎, ‎and ‎

said there was an existing sanitary sewer that ran from northwest to ‎

southeast‎. ‎There were ponds that were mitigation areas from the Hamlin ‎

Rd‎. ‎reconstruction‎. ‎There was a trail of crushed aggregate that ran back ‎

to the mitigation areas‎. ‎There were various habitats‎, ‎prairie‎, ‎various ‎

wetlands and hillside seep‎, ‎which was groundwater coming through to ‎

provide very unique micro‎-‎habitats‎. ‎He remarked that it was a very cool ‎

property with a lot going on‎. ‎

Mr‎. ‎Burton advised that the invasive species had taken over and done a ‎

lot of damage to the park‎. ‎They were harmful to the environment and to ‎

the value of the habitats‎. ‎The phragmites was dominate‎, ‎but there were ‎

about a dozen invasive species on the property‎. ‎The City faced that at all ‎

park properties where there was open water‎, ‎including in front of City Hall‎. ‎

Phragmites choked everything‎. ‎They looked wetland‎-‎like‎, ‎but there were ‎

no birds or animals heard‎. ‎He was adamant that they needed to get rid of ‎

it‎. ‎

Mr‎. ‎Burton commented that Mr‎. ‎Stolaruk was very descriptive in wanting a ‎

large area of open water‎. ‎There was an area that had the largest stand of ‎

phragmites on the property‎, ‎and it was also the inlet from some storm ‎

drainage off of Hamlin‎. ‎They felt that it was the perfect opportunity to ‎

remove the phragmites entirely and create an open water body‎. ‎On the ‎

west side of the existing trail‎, ‎there was a large area that was low quality‎, ‎

and it was converted into different invasives‎, ‎and they could remove that ‎

and turn it into a wildflower prairie‎. ‎Everywhere else‎, ‎they would do spot ‎

treatments‎. ‎It was not a matter of brush hogging the whole site and ‎

starting over‎; ‎it was a matter of getting in and hand treating and hand ‎

spraying‎.‎

Mr‎. ‎Burton referred to the existing park entranceway off of Hamlin‎. ‎They ‎

were looking at that area as a starting point for future development‎. ‎He ‎

showed a slide for phase ‎1 ‎of the current Master Plan for the park‎. ‎He ‎

referred to the entrance area as the business center of the park‎. ‎It would ‎

be on higher ground and be moved to the southwest corner‎. ‎It would have ‎

a parking lot‎, ‎maybe a shed for equipment storage‎, ‎restroom facilities‎, ‎

perhaps a park ranger station and drop off for schools and other groups‎. ‎

From there‎, ‎people could go off into the different trail areas‎. ‎There would ‎

be a main loop of paved trail for all users‎. ‎The whole park would have to ‎

be ADA compliant‎. ‎They wanted children‎, ‎seniors‎, ‎and able‎-‎bodied ‎

triathalon types to be able to utilize the park‎. ‎Once that area was done‎, ‎

there would be other trails in the future that would go around the unique ‎

habitats for educational purposes and outdoor classrooms‎. ‎They could ‎

have a kayak stop off point on the Clinton River‎. ‎They would do some ‎

stream restoration in the future‎. ‎He pointed out the area of Heritage ‎

Oaks‎, ‎and said that it would be desirable to make the pond work‎, ‎and they ‎

continued to talk with the Homeowner’s Association about that‎. ‎There ‎

would be no parking lots for car shows or big sports lighting or ‎

grandstands‎. ‎It would really be a true passive park‎.‎

Mr‎. ‎Burton summarized that phase ‎1 ‎would be access to the park‎. ‎As ‎

mentioned‎, ‎they would move the existing entrance further to the west and ‎

put in excel and decel taper lanes‎, ‎and phase ‎1 ‎would include a gravel ‎

parking lot‎. ‎They had not spent an enormous amount of time master ‎

planning what it would look like yet‎. ‎The first steps would be the initial ‎

restoration of the prairie and invasive species control‎, ‎the gravel lot‎, ‎a ‎

paved loop and connection to local trails‎. ‎There would be boardwalks ‎

over the wetlands and educational displays to keep people out of the ‎

wetlands‎. ‎There would be overlooks in the future‎, ‎from a simple deck ‎

overlay to more complex ones that the LTU students came up with like ‎

beaver huts and birds’ nests‎. ‎They would secure parts of the riverbank for ‎

fishing‎. ‎He maintained that the Clinton River was a regional gem that ‎

should be cherished and its banks protected‎. ‎They did not envision a ‎

kayak launch‎, ‎because someone would have to use a car to get to the ‎

back of the park‎, ‎and they did not want cars anywhere but at the ‎

entranceway‎. ‎There could be a stable point for kayakers who were ‎

already on the river to stop and have lunch or just enjoy the park and ‎

continue down the river‎. ‎

They were currently working on additional exploration and testing ‎

theories‎. ‎They were testing the soil for development‎. ‎They would begin ‎

immediately to start to control some of the invasives‎. ‎After that‎, ‎it was a ‎

matter of the City and the donor’s vision and everyone’s input to keep the ‎

ball rolling into future phases‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Burton said that he would be happy to ‎

answer any questions‎, ‎and he added that they really appreciated the ‎

opportunity to bring everyone up to date‎. ‎He remarked that for him‎, ‎it was ‎

great to be able to do something other than sewers and manholes‎.‎

Mr‎. ‎Schroeder asked who owned the property north of the park‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Anzek ‎

advised that it was in trust to the White family‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Schroeder asked if ‎

there was any potential for acquiring it‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Anzek said that the City had ‎

numerous conversations with the family‎, ‎but it had not progressed‎. ‎The ‎

City had done analyses for the ability of development‎. ‎It was very steep ‎

and with the Steep Slope Ordinance‎, ‎they would probably get six homes ‎

on ‎40 ‎acres‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Schroeder asked if the park would be able to acquire the ‎

piece owned by Heritage Oaks‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Burton said that the meetings went ‎

well‎. ‎The inherent value in the City taking care of the phragmites and the ‎

ability to access the river from their backyards was something the ‎

Heritage Oaks residents saw value in‎. ‎It was just a matter of working out ‎

the details and the City talking with them further‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Schroeder noted ‎

that Mr‎. ‎Stolaruk was a longtime contractor‎, ‎and he asked if Mr‎. ‎Stolaruk ‎

would do any of the work‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Burton agreed that he would‎. ‎It was his ‎

understanding that the deal was part payment for services and having Mr‎. ‎

Stolaruk do some of the work himself‎.‎

Mr‎. ‎Kaltsounis noted that he was at the presentation by the LTU students‎, ‎

and he remembered that there were a lot of good ideas‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Burton had ‎

mentioned the potential for the park‎, ‎and the students had also claimed ‎

that there was the potential for an amazing‎, ‎nature‎-‎filled area in the ‎

middle of their City‎. ‎The Master Plan followed some of the basic routings ‎

of what the students came up with‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Kaltsounis said that he liked the ‎

tie‎-‎in to the subdivision‎. ‎He cautioned that when it came to phases‎, ‎it was ‎

his opinion that if something was not planned‎, ‎it would not happen‎. ‎He ‎

was not sure about the scope of work intended‎, ‎but he thought that the ‎

different ideas presented by the students to make it a supreme nature ‎

center should be a part of the plan‎. ‎He knew getting the trails in was ‎

important‎, ‎but he wondered how someone could donate to something that ‎

was not there‎. ‎If they had an amazing park with a lot of special features‎, ‎

he wanted to make sure the excitement continued with the next step‎. ‎

Mr‎. ‎Burton said that he appreciated those comments‎. ‎He agreed‎, ‎and ‎

said that they also needed momentum and to move forward to meet the ‎

donor’s needs‎. ‎They were still in the process of developing the remaining ‎

improvements and possible program activities that could occur on the ‎

property‎. ‎Those would be a part of the Master Plan document‎. ‎They ‎

would work on cost estimates and try to identify all the next steps‎. ‎At the ‎

same time‎, ‎once access was there and the park was open‎, ‎it could drive ‎

more grass roots efforts‎. ‎They were working on getting the park open and ‎

getting things rolling‎, ‎but they were also working on the Master Plan for ‎

the rest of it‎. ‎Eventually‎, ‎he would present a Master Plan with all the ‎

activities‎, ‎including whether any buildings should be there and future ‎

layouts for other activities‎. ‎They were working on the vision so more ‎

people could get excited‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Kaltsounis said that he just wanted to make ‎

sure that was covered‎. ‎He had been to Costa Rica‎, ‎and he went to an ‎

amazing place in a natural habitat‎. ‎There was a main building and a ‎

couple of museums‎, ‎and then people could go out on cable cars to ‎

amazing places‎. ‎The City had that‎, ‎too‎, ‎and it could be shared with ‎

schools and people from the OPC‎, ‎and others looking for a hike‎.‎

Mr‎. ‎Burton indicated that the challenge that the Mayor had put forth was to ‎

make it a park with a “wow” factor‎. ‎They were working on creative ideas to ‎

make it a place where people would come because it was different than ‎

anywhere else‎. ‎They could not find seven different habitats anywhere ‎

else in suburban‎, ‎southeast Michigan‎, ‎but they had it at the park‎, ‎

including one that was phenomenal‎. ‎He believed that the story of the ‎

park would be as “cool” as the outcome‎. ‎He thought it would be great to ‎

have a video presentation that showed how they developed the park and ‎

why they made the decisions they did‎. ‎They planned to figure out how to ‎

document everything so they had a great narrative that went along with ‎

the park‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Kaltsounis said that he looked forward to seeing it through‎. ‎

Mr‎. ‎Hetrick stated that he would be really supportive of having the Master ‎

Plan as something with a vision that was also flexible and allowed for ‎

organic growth‎. ‎He agreed that as people went to and used the park‎, ‎the ‎

wow ideas would surface more so than having the team just think them up‎. ‎

The more it could be flexible to allow organic growth would be a good ‎

idea‎, ‎in his opinion‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Hetrick noted that the asphalt trail was meant for ‎

biker and walkers‎, ‎and he asked if the yellow trails would be primarily ‎

walking trails to get to a certain place or if they expected that runners and ‎

bikers would use those as well‎.‎

Mr‎. ‎Burton stated that the answer was that mountain bikers would go ‎

where mountain bikers wanted to go‎. ‎One of the tasks was to create ‎

different areas for different people to use so they did not create their own ‎

and go through the middle of where they were not supposed to go‎, ‎without ‎

putting up fences and big signs‎. ‎The second challenge was that all the ‎

paths needed to be ADA compliant‎. ‎Some would not be bike trails‎, ‎i‎.‎e‎.‎, ‎

12 ‎feet wide and two feet clear‎, ‎paved surface speedways‎. ‎That was for ‎

the outside loop‎. ‎The other trails were intended for people to go down to a ‎

specific area or outlook and return‎. ‎Either through rules or park ‎

guidelines‎, ‎they could limit bicyclists to the paved trail‎. ‎They hoped that ‎

by educating people about the project that people would just get it and not ‎

go somewhere they were not allowed‎. ‎The other trails would be set ‎

differently by width‎, ‎material and so on to make sure they were ‎

accessible‎, ‎but they would not be bicycle lanes‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Hetrick said it would ‎

limit who used the other trails and provide a level of safety‎. ‎He ‎

commented that the people on the Clinton River Trail had not quite ‎

figured out passing on the left‎. ‎Ideally‎, ‎he hoped that people would have ‎

a good time and a safe time‎.‎

Mr‎. ‎Hetrick asked how they would keep phragmites from coming back ‎

once they got rid of them‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Burton stated that phragmites were an ‎

absolute problem everywhere in the region with shallow water‎. ‎They did ‎

not like deep water‎, ‎so they could create a pond‎. ‎They would have to ‎

have an ongoing invasive species management program‎. ‎They would ‎

spray and watch it forever‎. ‎Biological controls had been looked into‎, ‎but ‎

for now‎, ‎they would either cut‎, ‎burn or dig them out‎. ‎They were very ‎

difficult‎, ‎and the City was fortunate that they were limited mostly that one ‎

area‎. ‎They had to dig a pond somewhere‎, ‎so where the phragmites were ‎

was the logical place‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Hetrick said that it sounded as if there was a lot ‎

of consideration being given to on‎-‎going maintenance of the park and to ‎

keep it in a pristine state of nature‎. ‎He thanked Mr‎. ‎Burton for the good ‎

work‎.‎

Hearing no further discussion‎, ‎Chairperson Boswell noted the Resolution ‎

of Support in the packet and asked if anyone wished to make a motion‎.‎

MOTION‎ by Schroeder‎, ‎seconded by Hetrick‎:‎

Resolved‎,‎ ‎that the Rochester Hills Planning Commission reviewed the ‎

proposed development plan for Riverbend Park at its June ‎18‎, ‎2013 ‎

meeting‎, ‎as prepared by Hubbell‎, ‎Roth ‎& ‎Clark‎; ‎Landscape Architects ‎

and Planners‎; ‎and Niswander Environmental and‎, ‎having reviewed and ‎

offered comments on the Plan is in support of the proposed plan and ‎

endorses its implementation‎.‎

Mr‎. ‎Kaltsounis said they had reviewed the plan‎, ‎and he wondered about ‎

the next steps‎. ‎He said that he was looking forward to seeing the next ‎

steps‎.‎

Mr‎. ‎Anzek said that Mr‎. ‎Burton said it very well in his presentation as to ‎

why they broke it into several phases‎. ‎Initially‎, ‎it was kind of fast tracked ‎

because the donor really wanted it done as quickly as possible‎. ‎A more ‎

important point was that the plan was done with MDEQ in mind because ‎

they really needed their approvals and permits as quickly as possible‎. ‎

The City did not want to put in a lot of the “wow” portion yet‎, ‎and it was a ‎

conscious decision‎. ‎The Planning Commission would see the plan again ‎

as those things were polished and they had more time to work the MDEQ‎. ‎

If they did want to do something extreme‎, ‎like build a big bird’s next that ‎

hung out over a pond‎, ‎it would not have been permitted in this type of ‎

proposal‎. ‎He assured that the Planning Commission would see future ‎

amplifications of the plan‎.‎

A motion was made by Schroeder‎, ‎seconded by Hetrick that a Resolution of ‎

Support be approved‎.‎

Aye

Boswell‎, ‎Brnabic‎, ‎Dettloff‎, ‎Hetrick‎, ‎Hooper‎, ‎Kaltsounis‎, ‎Reece‎, ‎Schroeder ‎

and Yukon‎

9 -

2006-0226

Proposed single‎-‎family residential development ‎- ‎City File No‎. ‎03‎-‎009 ‎- ‎

Rochester Enclaves‎, ‎on ‎30 ‎acres located on the east side of Rochester ‎

Road‎, ‎north of Tienken ‎(‎north of Cross Creek Sub‎)‎, ‎Parcel Nos‎. ‎

15‎-‎02‎-‎177‎-‎001 ‎and ‎15‎-‎02‎-‎102‎-‎023‎, ‎TJ Realvest‎, ‎LLC‎, ‎applicant‎.‎

(‎Reference‎: ‎Memo prepared by James Breuckman‎, ‎dated June ‎13‎, ‎2013 ‎

and letter from Jerry Kisil of TJ Realvest‎, ‎LLC dated June ‎7‎, ‎2013 ‎had ‎

been placed on file and by reference became part of the record thereof‎.)‎

Present for the applicant were Jerry Kisil and Tom Cooney TJ Realvest‎, ‎

LLC‎, ‎54153 ‎Deer Ridge Ct‎.‎, ‎Rochester‎, ‎MI ‎48307 ‎and Ralph Nunez‎, ‎

Design Team Plus‎, ‎975 ‎E‎. ‎Maple Rd‎.‎, ‎Birmingham‎, ‎MI ‎48009‎..‎

Mr‎. ‎Kisil stated that the proposed development was tentatively named ‎

Rochester Enclaves‎, ‎and it was located north of Tienken on the east side ‎

of Rochester Road‎. ‎The property bounded the Cross Creek Subdivision ‎

to the south‎, ‎and it was on approximately ‎30 ‎acres on two parcels‎. ‎He ‎

showed a concept of the layout of the development‎. ‎They proposed ‎25 ‎

single‎-‎family units‎. ‎Their intent was to develop a luxury home ‎

development‎, ‎and the homes would start at ‎4‎,‎500 ‎square feet‎. ‎The ‎

tentative pricing would be ‎$‎700‎,‎000‎.‎00 ‎and up‎. ‎They hoped to have a ‎

gated community‎, ‎which he knew would be subject to discussion‎. ‎They ‎

intended to preserve approximately one‎-‎half of the property‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Kisil ‎

showed some home elevations that they were currently building or had ‎

recently completed‎, ‎and said that the proposed development would have ‎

similar styles‎. ‎

Mr‎. ‎Kisil noted that he and Mr‎. ‎Cooney were both members of TJ ‎

Realvest‎, ‎LLC‎, ‎the proposed developers‎, ‎and they were each owners and ‎

presidents of other companies‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Kisil was President and General ‎

Counsel of JBK Construction Co‎.‎, ‎which was established in ‎1987‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎

Cooney was President of Lakeview Contracting‎, ‎which was established in ‎

1956‎, ‎and they joined forces in ‎1999 ‎to form TJ Realvest‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Kisil ‎

mentioned some of the projects that had completed‎. ‎They were finishing ‎

up Deer Ridge in Rochester ‎- ‎13 ‎luxury homes priced up to ‎$‎900‎,‎000‎.‎00‎. ‎

Their most recent project in Rochester Hills was Hazelwood at Livernois ‎

and Auburn‎, ‎which was done about nine years ago and had ‎35 ‎units‎. ‎They ‎

had a large project outside Lansing called Centennial Farms‎, ‎which was a ‎

PUD with ‎177 ‎lots‎, ‎and they did a recent condominium project in Sterling ‎

Heights with ‎35 ‎units‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Kisil recalled that they had approached the ‎

Planning Commission about seven years ago‎, ‎before the recent ‎

economic downturn‎, ‎and presented a conceptual review for the same ‎

property for ‎35 ‎condominium units‎, ‎for which they gained support‎. ‎The ‎

condos were two and three unit buildings‎. ‎They had made substantial ‎

modifications for the current project‎, ‎while still preserving the wetland ‎

areas and other areas‎. ‎They reduced the total units from ‎35 ‎to ‎25‎. ‎He ‎

turned the discussion over to Mr‎. ‎Nunez‎.‎

Mr‎. ‎Nunez commented about the Riverbend Park concept and how it was ‎

an honor to work in the City with an excellent Staff‎. ‎The City opened ‎

Riverbend Park last summer for ‎18 ‎students to get a real world ‎

experience working on a project‎. ‎The students camped out and had a ‎

blast‎, ‎and they were still talking to him about the park‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Nunez said ‎

that he planned to talk with Mr‎. ‎Anzek about another team they had that ‎

would like to do something in the City again‎. ‎He reiterated that there were ‎

some excellent people working for the City‎.‎

Mr‎. ‎Nunez noted that he was a registered Landscape Architect and Urban ‎

Planner‎. ‎He had been in practice for ‎30 ‎years with Design Team‎. ‎This ‎

past year‎, ‎he changed the name to Design Team Plus‎, ‎and he had an ‎

architect and an interior designer on board‎, ‎and they had expanded their ‎

services‎. ‎He was going on his ‎20‎th year teaching at Lawrence Tech‎.‎, ‎and ‎

he had done a number of successful‎, ‎challenging projects in the City‎. ‎

The last one he worked on was Harvard Place‎.‎

Mr‎. ‎Nunez commented that a lot of the easy sites were built‎. ‎The subject ‎

site was not one of those‎. ‎There were ‎30 ‎acres with sloped areas‎, ‎and ‎

about ‎10‎.‎4 ‎acres of wetlands‎, ‎and it was heavily vegetated‎. ‎There was a ‎

good upland woodlot and a healthy mix of trees onsite‎. ‎There were some ‎

problems with ash trees and some dead elms in the lower region‎. ‎They ‎

looked at the previous plans again‎, ‎and they started talking with Staff‎. ‎

They wanted to make the new development an up north kind of ‎

development‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Anzek had always challenged him on the goal for the ‎

site‎, ‎and Mr‎. ‎Nunez had to figure out how to make it work‎. ‎There was an ‎

existing lane on the north side ‎(‎Tree Top Lane‎) ‎that went into two ‎

properties to the east‎. ‎They created a boulevard entrance and worked the ‎

road the best as they could with the existing grades in order to try to ‎

minimize the impact‎. ‎They had to balance the the City’s goals and the ‎

development goals‎, ‎including working with the Fire Department and the ‎

Engineering Department‎, ‎so they had some work cut out‎. ‎They tried to ‎

identify the length of the cul‎-‎de‎-‎sac‎. ‎They wanted to minimize the impact ‎

to the existing neighbors to the north and the two to the northeast‎. ‎They ‎

wanted to create a complete neighborhood in bringing the traffic in to the ‎

end‎. ‎They were working with the Fire Department on the road widths‎. ‎

They had a ‎60‎-‎foot right‎-‎of‎-‎way and a driveway coming to the south for two ‎

units‎. ‎Engineering would have to look closely at the wetland crossings ‎

and the wetland mitigations‎. ‎They wanted to keep it within the one‎-‎third ‎

rule‎, ‎so they did not have to take it to the Federal level‎. ‎Stormwater ‎

detention would be at the low end of the site before it went into the ‎

wetlands‎. ‎

Mr‎. ‎Nunez noted that the pads would be ‎70 ‎x ‎70 ‎feet‎, ‎with ‎30 ‎feet between ‎

each of the units‎. ‎They met the setbacks of ‎30 ‎feet from the front and a ‎

minimum of ‎35 ‎feet in the back‎. ‎Any development along Rochester Road ‎

was pushed even further back to a minimum of ‎50 ‎feet‎, ‎so they could ‎

keep a lot of the existing vegetation and augment it with additional ‎

plantings‎. ‎They would try to do something similar to what the City had ‎

done with its entrance road and the bike paths‎. ‎The Fire Department ‎

wanted ‎26 ‎feet of pavement because of the outriggers‎, ‎and the ‎

developers would like a sidewalk‎. ‎He understood that most fire trucks did ‎

not have a reverse‎, ‎so they had to make sure the loop worked‎. ‎They ‎

would have a meeting with the Fire Department to see if they could do an ‎

integral sidewalk curb and have the storm drain on one side‎. ‎It would give ‎

a narrower looking width‎, ‎and it would reduce the speed‎.‎

Mr‎. ‎Nunez showed an aerial of the site‎, ‎reiterating that it was heavily ‎

vegetated‎. ‎They looked at Walnut Brook Estates‎, ‎and one of the things ‎

he liked about that was the large vegetation at the end of the cul‎-‎de‎-‎sac‎. ‎

The site did not have requirements for woodland replacement‎, ‎but the ‎

developer still placed large trees‎. ‎He showed another subdivision road in ‎

Rochester Hills‎. ‎It had a normal roadway width and sidewalks and not a ‎

lot of trees‎. ‎They would like to keep the sidewalk more toward a narrow ‎

road for their project and have more trees in front of the homes‎.‎

Mr‎. ‎Hooper asked what the current zoning was‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Nunez replied that it ‎

was RE‎, ‎Residential Estate‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Hooper asked why they could not ‎

develop it under RE rather than going the PUD route‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Nunez said ‎

that it was because of the extensive wetlands‎, ‎woodlands and also the ‎

slopes‎. ‎The density they showed was ‎.‎81 ‎per acre‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Hooper asked if ‎

they would not be able to put in ‎25 ‎homes under RE‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Nunez said that ‎

doing a more conventional subdivision would restrict what they could do‎. ‎

They especially wanted to do private roads‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Hooper said that other ‎

than a revised street layout and size of the lots‎, ‎he did not see another ‎

issue to use a PUD over conventional zoning‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Nunez believed that ‎

the site lent itself to preserving as much of the vegetation as they could ‎

versus what could be done in an RE development‎.‎

Mr‎. ‎Kisil responded that with RE single‎-‎family lots‎, ‎it would allow ‎

individual homeowners to be able to remove all vegetation within a large ‎

footprint‎. ‎In their case‎, ‎they would condense the development to the ‎

uplands and outside the heavily treed areas and preserve as much of the ‎

vegetation and leave a larger buffer zone around the wetland areas‎. ‎It ‎

would give the overall appearance of a large‎, ‎open park atmosphere with ‎

the housing being in a tighter neighborhood layout‎.‎

Mr‎. ‎Hooper said that Mr‎. ‎Kisil mentioned having a gated community‎, ‎and ‎

he asked Mr‎. ‎Kisil if he was considering putting gates at the two entrances ‎

shown‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Kisil said that they would just be at the boulevard entrance‎. ‎

Mr‎. ‎Hooper thought that would defeat the purpose of having a gated ‎

community‎, ‎noting that someone could come into Tree Top Lane and go ‎

right into the sub‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Kisil explained that it would not necessarily be for ‎

security purposes‎, ‎but for aesthetics‎.‎

Chairperson Boswell remembered traipsing the property about six or ‎

seven years ago‎, ‎and at that time‎, ‎he thought that a PUD was about the ‎

only avenue that would work‎. ‎He realized that it was zoned RE now‎, ‎but a ‎

lot of the land would not be able to be used‎.‎

Mr‎. ‎Kaltsounis recalled that when he was a new Planning Commissioner‎, ‎

he heard a lot of complaints about the Hazelwood Condos when he had ‎

lived down the street from there‎. ‎It was approved right before he got on ‎

the Commission‎, ‎and then it was built‎, ‎but he was aware of it‎. ‎He had ‎

mentioned Hazelwood because of the density‎. ‎His concern would be how ‎

close the proposed development would be to the surrounding ‎

environment‎. ‎They might be able to make a case based upon the people ‎

to the south‎. ‎He was concerned about the sidewalks proposed and that ‎

they would be connected to the road‎, ‎acknowledging that everything had ‎

not been worked out yet‎. ‎He liked the idea of the development ‎

personally‎, ‎but he was dead set against the sidewalks being connected to ‎

the road‎. ‎He mentioned that in Walnut Brooks Estates‎, ‎families that had ‎

purchased one of those homes had moved nine families in‎. ‎He ‎

wondered where all the cars would go if that happened‎. ‎Those were things ‎

he had to consider‎, ‎because it was something people complained to him ‎

about‎. ‎He was not always wild about PUDs‎, ‎and he always tried to see if ‎

there were other creative options they could use‎, ‎but if they had to use ‎

one‎, ‎they had to‎. ‎He would like to see the sidewalks separated by a ‎

couple of feet‎, ‎because people would drive right next to the road and use ‎

every bit of it‎. ‎He added that he liked the general direction of the project‎.‎

Mr‎. ‎Kisil noted that they had presented the property to the Open Space ‎

Advisory Board about two years ago‎. ‎The Board encouraged them to ‎

stay at the type of development they had originally proposed to move and ‎

condense the development to one portion of the property‎. ‎They were ‎

excited about the fact that there would be a lot of open green spaces that ‎

would maintain‎. ‎Regarding the attached sidewalks‎, ‎Mr‎. ‎Kisil said that he ‎

would leave those technicalities to Mr‎. ‎Nunez and Planning‎. ‎They could ‎

certainly do some enforcement and require onsite parking‎. ‎They ‎

anticipated having four‎-‎car garages with driveways for an additional four ‎

to six cars‎. ‎He felt that would have a bearing as to how much parking ‎

would be on the street‎.‎

Mr‎. ‎Breuckman brought up the sidewalk issue‎, ‎and said that Staff had ‎

some conversations about it‎. ‎The whole goal was to try to keep the street ‎

as narrow as they could to keep traffic speeds down‎. ‎They would like to ‎

have a ‎25 ‎m‎.‎p‎.‎h‎. ‎design speed‎, ‎and in order to do that‎, ‎they had to have a ‎

narrower street‎. ‎Regarding the issue of separating the sidewalk‎, ‎the ‎

sidewalk would have dual purpose‎. ‎It would be identified as pedestrian ‎

space‎, ‎but it would also serve the Fire Code requirements‎. ‎The Fire Code ‎

required a ‎26‎-‎foot wide roadway‎. ‎If they moved the sidewalks off the road‎, ‎

they would still have to have a ‎26‎-‎foot wide roadway and a five‎-‎foot ‎

sidewalk and then they would have to move the sidewalk back eight feet ‎

from the edge of the pavement to have room to plant trees‎. ‎All of a ‎

sudden they would go from being able to move away from the wetlands ‎

and trees to pushing everything ‎20 ‎feet further out in order to ‎

accommodate the sidewalks‎. ‎25 ‎units would not generate high traffic ‎

counts‎, ‎and he felt it might be worth considering attached sidewalks like ‎

the City had at its entrance drive‎, ‎treating the side of the road differently to ‎

identify that it was not driver space but pedestrian space‎. ‎He maintained ‎

that they were going after efficiencies‎.‎

Mr‎. ‎Kaltsounis stated that it was beneficial to have discussions before an ‎

applicant spent a lot of money and presented plans‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Nunez said that ‎

he appreciated it‎, ‎and they would look at different alternatives‎. ‎They still ‎

had to bring the other players into the meeting‎. ‎He acknowledged that it ‎

was a safety issue‎, ‎and they understood the Fire Department’s concerns‎. ‎

They had to come up with creative solutions that met everyone’s goals‎. ‎

He noted that they were also proposing a safety path along Rochester Rd‎. ‎

and stop off areas for bikers or walkers‎. ‎There was a piece of real estate ‎

that was upland and there was an area at the southern portion of the site ‎

that they could put in naturalized benches that were more rustic‎-‎looking‎.‎

Mr‎. ‎Schroeder asked if it would be possible to put in a very low‎, ‎

mountable curb adjacent to the pavement and sidewalk‎. ‎The curb would ‎

delineate and be easily mounted‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Breuckman thought they could‎, ‎but ‎

it would be a detail they would have to look into‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Schroeder felt it ‎

would be a good solution‎, ‎and he added that it was a very nice ‎

development‎.‎

Mr‎. ‎Reece said that based on the layout‎, ‎and the issue with the sidewalks‎, ‎

he rather liked where they were going with the plan‎. ‎There would be a very ‎

limited number of houses‎, ‎and if they looked at the main road going back ‎

to the end‎, ‎there would only be ‎14 ‎along that route‎. ‎There would be ‎

bigger homes‎, ‎wider driveways and bigger garages‎, ‎and that would get the ‎

cars off the street‎. ‎They would expect to have cars parked in garages or ‎

in the driveways in a sub of this type‎, ‎not in the road‎. ‎There would always ‎

be the case of someone having a graduation party or similar event‎, ‎but ‎

that would not be the norm‎, ‎and they had to plan better for the norm‎. ‎He ‎

stated that the unusual circumstances should not dictate what they were ‎

doing‎. ‎He said that he liked the layout‎, ‎and although they had some work ‎

do to going forward‎, ‎he felt that they were on the right path‎.‎

Mr‎. ‎Kisil commented that between Mr‎. ‎Anzek‎, ‎Mr‎. ‎Breuckman and Mr‎. ‎

Nunez‎, ‎they really pushed the bounds of what he was normally ‎

accustomed to in development‎. ‎They suggested that it be developed into ‎

something quite unique and something very special‎, ‎with a winding road ‎

and up north feeling‎. ‎They became excited about the opportunity‎, ‎and he ‎

added that he would probably become a resident of the community‎. ‎He ‎

did not think this type of development was found in most communities‎, ‎

especially in urban centers with the type of atmosphere it had‎. ‎He ‎

thanked Staff for “pushing their envelopes‎.‎”‎

Mr‎. ‎Schroeder remarked that the curbing road they had designed was a ‎

traffic engineer’s dream‎. ‎It cut down on speeds and was a great ‎

advantage‎.‎

Chairperson Boswell felt that a majority of the Commissioners liked the ‎

plan and would like to see it come forward‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎Nunez said that they ‎

would be back shortly‎, ‎and he thanked the Commissioners‎.‎

Discussed

ANY OTHER BUSINESS

Mr‎. ‎Kaltsounis brought up that on April ‎10‎, ‎2013‎, ‎an old house on Auburn ‎

between Crooks and Adams caught on fire and burned down‎. ‎The house ‎

had since been torn down‎, ‎but there were a rather large amount of ‎

contents from inside the house that did not burn down‎, ‎and they were ‎

sitting on two bus‎-‎sized large piles on either side of the house‎. ‎They ‎

looked like giant piles of clothes‎. ‎The house was mainly gone ‎- ‎there was ‎

a back porch and entrance ‎- ‎but there was a lot of junk left‎, ‎and he asked ‎

if Staff could look into it‎. ‎

Mr‎. ‎Reece said that on a similar vein‎, ‎there was a house that had been ‎

under construction in Hillside Creek that had been waiting to be bricked ‎

for a year or so‎. ‎It looked like the developer had walked away from it‎. ‎It ‎

was the second house in‎, ‎and it had been sitting for months with the bricks ‎

scattered across the site and sand and mortar everywhere‎. ‎Mr‎. ‎

Breuckman said that he would look into that also‎.‎

Mr‎. ‎Hetrick mentioned that the work had started on the Taco Bell on ‎

Walton‎. ‎

NEXT MEETING DATE

Chairperson Boswell reminded the Commissioners that the next Regular ‎

Meeting was scheduled for July ‎16‎, ‎2013‎.‎

ADJOURNMENT

Hearing no futher business to come before the Planning Commission‎, ‎and ‎

upon motion by Kaltsounis‎, ‎Chairperson Boswell adjourned the Regular ‎

Meeting at ‎8‎:‎43 ‎p‎.‎m‎.‎

_____________________________‎

William F‎. ‎Boswell‎, ‎Chairperson‎

Rochester Hills Planning Commission‎

_____________________________‎

Nicholas O‎. ‎Kaltsounis‎, ‎Secretary‎

Rochester Hills Planning Commission‎